Hello everyone, this is Leon Vanguard of angers plaything and this is Ironman vanguard of vanguard smithing
And today we're talking about our experience on forged in fire
Okay for anyone that wants to go just to our experience with the show go and skip forward to this link right here so
I cant add a link yet but go to 6:18, or click link in description
The first thing I want to talk about today is my experience in blacksmithing and meeting Ironman for the first time
I met him back in 2005 and he got me into doing Arbor
by just asking me to show up at his house and you'll teach me blacksmithing cuz
He's free and he'd want me to teach so I show up his house at Saturday and he was surprised
I showed up because anyone who's ever been a black the teacher knows that everyone wants to learn but no one shows up
Yeah
Yeah
I you'll have a hundred people literally ask you to learn to teach them blacksmithing and
You'll be lucky to see one just show up
Yeah, - maybe two will show up and then they'll never show up again after you know
They find out that you're playing with real fire, you know, people are scared of fire nowadays
And some world that's for around a good a good eight years. I was
via some of his advice YouTube videos and other things do my own blacksmithing armor work and from there I around
2015 or so. I started getting into some hot work and some light work and that's when in
2016 Iron Man called me up and he
Wanted to make on the show fortune fire with him
I was taking it back a little bit first, but um, he knows my abilities
He knows anything about because we talked a lot on and off again
I asked him questions about metallurgy cuz his background is as a machinist as a chemist and then as a blacksmith
So I go to fram. Why is this happening? Why is this happening?
So when he told me I wouldn't go on the show with me and make nice I go well, you know
You know, you don't make knives. Yeah, you make armors
I make armor
But translating the knowledge was is there's a lot of chemist is more chemistry involved than smithing what it goes to go from coal
work the hot work and I understand a lot about how the metal moves and
But I need to go to him and we need to go over some things cuz I had made some knives where you called stock
removal where you chop up some
steel
Clench it, and you now have a knife
But for the show obviously a lot more than that. Yeah. Yeah
He said there's more to it than just stock removal. In fact, there was a contestant on am
Prasad. Yeah
they
They booted him off for that because he played it safe and he decided to stalk remove his blade and they want to see you
Actually forge a blade
It's forged in fire. Not grandma not ground in fire
Yeah, so for uh, well, how many knives did you make Leland before the shoot for the show aired?
I had only been around around six knives and Ally forged one
so I told while around seven knives before I went on that show and
The trip yeah, so this for training on the show when I had a drive up to Utah from Southern, California, it's at seven
It's an 11 hour drive. It's 11 hour drive and
He went okay. I'm not gonna give a piece of
Alloyed steel we are gonna go to Home Depot. We are going to take nails
There are magnesium iron with very little impurities, but there'll own carbon
we're gonna use hard lump charcoal and different blowers to refine this charcoal or shigani style and
That's what your builds gonna be. We're gonna make your steel from scratch. I'm gonna do you got a forge well,
This this this this and this instead of just teach me how to take a piece of bar and go, huh?
There's your knife
Yeah
my curriculum with Leon was I
Wasn't going to just show him how to shape a knife or shape a piece of steel into that of a knife
I was going to show him how to make his own blade steel from scrap metal that you would normally find that would be for
lack of a better term
Not blade worthy
most Steel's that you usually find are too low of carbon to actually use as a blade steel and
so I showed him how to make his own high carbon blade steel, you know, essentially using scrap you can run around with a
Magnet picking up, you know nails screws, etc out of fire pits over and I go camping, you know
And you can actually turn that into sword
Not too many people know how to do that
And so that was one of the first things I showed him how to do was to make his own blade
Co-efficient me make his own blade steel
So that way he will never be in a situation where he does not have a high carbon blade steel
And we went over the process very authentic Japanese style because I do work in the Japanese
I do work as a Japanese blade Smith
So therefore I showed him the traditional methods of what's known as oral. Shigani
whereas we will add the carbon into the steel as it begins to melt down the stack and weld itself into a bloom in the
Bottom and from the bloom we have to hammer it down into a sheet break the sheet up take the the pieces of the broken
Sheet three stack them back up
Heat the build it back up and then weld everything solid and then once everything's solid we're going to hot chisel right in the very
Center fold it back over again and then continue to fold over until the steel is refined enough to where it wouldn't crack
So and that was a lot of fun. It was a good weekend
Healing muscle in my arm that wasn't actually ready for it which only put the mild amount of pain was
Right here the pick up muscle. So all it's a fun experience
And yeah, as you as you pick your hand up just like that and you raise your wrist
That's that's where that muscle right there comes from now
I've worked a lot a lot of hammers, but not with a four pound sledge for ten hours
Yeah, but now I have a lot of experience doing that after the show
I didn't so much so many more blades and so much more experience with Howard after the show
But I did as much that cut before the show and the time we had
That's good, okay. So now for people that are just here to learn about okay
You're going on the show or you want to pick up what happened with us on the show?
Here's this for you. Okay, so
well
Getting the call. So Arvin called me up Ziggy. I walk in the show
You have a better shop set your button better shop soap than me
And he knew my experience and I knew my experience and I knew we had to do some bootcamping
Yeah, so we did a boot camping and we're not even stripping me on the show yet if you're applying and you got a callback
You'll need at least four to seven more callbacks interviews before going on the show
and you do not know you're on the show until literally they gave you a date of when you're flying out and
Even still you don't know if that's gonna really happen until they give you the tickets. So keep being eager honest and
Ready to go and reply as fast you can strike out on the show
you're looking at six month waiting period
At least for us
Yeah
I have I was actually trying to get on the show since 2015 so it took me
About two years to finally get on the show
Okay, so now I don't think the contestants on the show. It was amazing
All the groups were awesome talking with them being with them. We were all there to compete against the show and the challenge
We're all very is very nice to talk with everybody. It felt like your go to a blacksmith conference and you're just hanging out
None of them are any we're hyper competitive or like in our face
I'm like, oh you're going down there just never have said yeah. Hey, we're gonna win
We were there to fight against the network and the challenge but we were we work in a mad dog each other
It was so we were
Once I hope a translates on the on screen as well
We were all really good friends and we still talk a lot than this day
And we're all really excited because it this show is gonna air in two days
So yeah, I know it is pretty awesome. You actually have to prove your skill to be on the show. I actually forged
katana on the side of Willard Peak using duct tape bag bellows and
a three-pound cross beam
for an input shaft on a knee for OD for trans mission
and I did that in three days to prove to the judges and to the the producers that not only am I a
Bladesmith but I could produce a blade by myself as the final challenge of a given length
you know and and have it, you know ready to be shipped off within the five day a
Challenge period and so that's that's what I did to essentially get on the show is to prove to them that yes
I can complete the final challenge if I make it that fall. I need to put on the show
You really do and for our experience?
When you go when you when you actually get on the show
You're actually you're pulling out there they pay for your ticket to pay for your transport. They pay for everything essentially except your food
they pay for food on set but um
they basically pay for anything except your food offset and
Even still they gave us some vouchers to go eaten breakfast. So, um, you don't bring a lot of money. I only spend
$169 for the entire trip and we whether or not you win or lose you get a stipend for around a hundred seventy bucks
Yeah, so I got paid $6 for all-expense-paid vacation to New York, which was awesome
Yeah, it was a lot of fun, too
So when you one thing that was concerned about going on the show
First of all any questions you have they will answer it any problems you have they will address it
So if you have any random questions, or if you're concerned about one particular thing, don't they'll take care of you
One thing I was concerned about was okay. You have to make
a
daikatana or you have to make
Let's think of them some it's some weird blade you've never heard before and you're like and they go go
And you think that now? Oh gosh, I
Live, you know with the shape of this blade. I know the parameters. I'm know what kind of granite usually has
So don't worry about that. They will bring you up on the set
They will announce what it is and then they'll cut they'll do that take around three times
It's TV. You're gonna do a lot of takes
And then looking to the back room and they'll give you a pamphlet
They'll answer any questions
they'll tell you what they're expecting the exact parameters and
There are no and any questions you have will be taken care of before you actually have to go out for the competition
And so there's no role
Knowledge-based answers or questions that you won't get answered
They won't tell you if you should drift you should tell if they should do this or do that
But they will tell you what they want and it's up to our techniques to figure out. Yeah, they just give you a basic
Specification they you'll have things like length
Any specialties such as a width that we had to do a two inch wide blade
For finger holes on our little knuckle duster
So you'll have those specifications that they will list out as well
As you know what the material of the blade is going to be and then on top of it, you know
They're going to give you a little
Demo piece they had this little trench knife that looked like somebody had ordered from you know, Amazon or something. Yeah
It was just a little letter opener
but it was just enough to kind of give you an idea of what you're supposed to make and
So they will clarify quite a bit with you before they say oh, you know, yeah
Exactly and day one you show up you get settled in day two
That's when you you do a lot of filming you start early
You do all your pre takes you do all your a lot a lot of your general a lot of those
Pre-rolled videos and stuff. Yeah
General interviews things of that nature. Yeah, they threw us out there I think was by 9 o'clock
9 or 10 o'clock they had the foragers going we were we were gonna start going
And also it's interesting for anyone that's concerned
One of the people were concerned about how hot it wasn't the Forge
From some of the videos and I watched a parent that was like, oh we can issue a concern
It might have gotten a little bit warm
It's at the end
but it was hot when you're like right there in front of the forge or when you're like right over either your metal beyond I
Was expecting it to be a it to be a sweatshop. But yeah
before in so if you're concerned about being too hot, I
Can hop from California? It's always hot where I am. Yeah, it was fine
I know some people might have problems with that but it never got unbearably hot ever. Yeah, this town is amazing
We're we any questions we had especially for Elba need water. We need Gatorade
We need this we need that they were running for us. They were they were doing everything they could to make it
bearable and as
comfortable as possible
Yeah, the staff gets an A+ all the way around they really went above and beyond for us as a blacksmith's and the competitors for
Everybody there's a lot of takes and a lot of waiting
But once that timer starts for the outro challenge
They don't stop because it doesn't - takes for the challenges when the child starts you only have the foot for this
It was 4 hours. Yeah
Yeah, it was and we only I only got to work on the knife for two hours at a time
He only got to work on it for two hours. That was it. No, that's the whole competition
So you get flown out to New York for an entire week just to work for two hours
Or at our case only for two hours. Yeah. I also make a shout out for Amanda
She was our personal chaperone and our first fan
First met a groupie. Yeah and
She was our chaperone. She made sure were taken care of
But she was there one that caught us from our hotel to the set and took care of us for the most of the experience
And that was all and she did a great job. Yeah. Yes. She did. She was really amazing. Very polite very
Knowledgeable and you know, I mean just straight down
What would be the best way to put it she was right on par with schedule, you know, she's awesome. She did everything
mark and Jessica
they were really fun to talk with and hang out with that a lot of fun stories and
They were just they were characters. It was fun to talk with them and it was
Joe and Casey they were
Watching them work. It was literally like watching two guys in a cnc shop with a mill
I'm just working the way they work in sync just in the sink and
Just straight forward and they were fun to watch. Yeah. Yeah, those two really definitely knew what they were doing
They knew what each other we're thinking. They didn't even have to tell each other nothing. It was just a boat boom. Boom
In fact more than likely we had just us kind of sitting back to the back side had more
Conversations with them than they did with each other
And I'm not saying that they weren't communicating. They just they already knew what the other one was thinking
So that's how well of a team they were
mark and Jessica
They are watching it with art. Yeah, that was art those two are the perfect team as well
I mean just the way they handled everything again
They almost knew what each other needed when they needed it how they needed it. And so it was really interested
It was a pleasure to watch those no
You know, I just my three years work was was watching a wrecking ball of ferocity, and that's a good way
I'm not saying that they were doing bad. I'm saying watching them
It was like the the full body hammer strokes they've having to literally mount that anvil because it was so high watching them work was
Like Mike Hill trying to wrestle like Russell a stallion. It was fun to watch. Yeah was definitely interesting
So yeah, it was a lot of fun. Yeah
now to talk a little about
What actually happened?
Okay, so I hadn't done any drafting before so we're applying to some a little bit different
Yeah, yeah hindsight is twenty-twenty. It didn't work out as well as planned
And we would have probably just drifted if you were thought about but we were like hey, let's do something different. Everyone's doing drifting
Let's try something. Even if we drifted we'd still would have run into so many problems. So
You know we did what we could and we had fun but
Personally during the show. I'll do my take then you can do yours. I
Was the one the girl first and I was very happy that my first time using a power press
Within one app times using it I was good
No, I think I was permanent on using it and then the power hammer my first time ever using a power hammer
One or two times using it and I can walk it with confidence
Anyway, that's never use a power hammer. It's literally just something striking for you. It's very very efficient, and it's very easy to work with
and I was happy and
That I was able to get our man a billet a nice flat billet to work with versus here's still a chunk
That looks like a block that I got a half an hour ago
So your first a bar go
Solely on ends up giving me this this piece of steel and I immediately go over to the press
I've got more experience with presses than I do power hammers and
so I start putting on this thing on the press and
One thing I noticed is it wasn't a very strong press you will see me fight this this press over and over again
In fact barriers to our right also wear having some issues moving their steel on this press
I don't know if the pressure was turned down too much or or what but it just was not moving the steel
And we had a huge problem trying to get that that steel to move with this press
So you can kind of see me struggling trying to move the steel around I finally give up on it
I got a hammer, you know to the anvil and pick up a hammer and I started using the hammer
well
The the hammer had too long of a nose on it and the anvil was too high so you can see my hammer strings going
Everywhere and I and I just give up on that hammer
I throw to the side and on a side note bring a hammer of your choice
Yeah, bring a hammer of your choice other hammers
They only have two or three hammers to use and if the and the anvil is not going to be the right height for you
So that's going to be a problem. You can see that with the farriers. You can see that with us
But yeah, it's anyways, you know
So at the end of this this round is I got it
somewhat it looked like a bunch of hammered whatever but most of the work had already been put into it and we are so
Confident we are yeah, we were we're very confident until I want to say our third heat
That's yeah, there's a second our yeah our second ours
Let me sort of realize but we were very happy with the way it's shaping up and we felt that we were
Merely in this challenge, but when we when we had the problem with that bar
Trying to make it trying to trying to make that into a nice slotted block. It just wasn't moving in. Yeah
That's when I hope the show iterates this where we real were felt. We're on the right track until that and then
music use
Did a little it did it but Plan B. I know we made good. I think we think you're making a making good TV
Thank you, but the one thing you have to make sure you understand is this is TV and
For a lousy view home I go. Well, I would have done this and I love done that
No, there's a lot of time for that
there's a lot of time for this but there's not a lot of time on the show and your own shop you can you can
Spend an hour or two
Figuring something out. But on the show know you only have the four hours
You have to think on your feet when you are on the floor
The reason why it looked so rough is because we spent more time trying to get that handled
You know situated than any thing else though when it comes down to it
He don't hurt you so much
There's only so much you can do and in the allotted time that they give you
You can't go back and fix your mistakes. You don't have time for that
You don't have time to even think you have to get on your feet
If you know when you have a plan B
You have to already have that Plan B in your mind before you already screw it up
I want to plan B much quicker than you think. Yeah. Don't don't hate plenty isn't working
Don't don't think about planning think about Plan B. Yeah, don't hesitate to move to a different plan
So I just thought we are struggling in the end
But the one thing it's very important to understand is this is TV, and they also don't want they want two things from you
They want you to never quit
Yeah and no matter what they just want you to at least have a
Quench plate on the table and although our blade was rough roughness for any bladesmith. They know can be taken out with a grinder
No, it can be fixed with a welder within an hour. We could have had our knives looking really beautiful
You know, it's just but we weren't focused on what our knife looked like. We were just getting it out
Yeah we just needed to get something within this dimension hardened and on the anvil in that time frame and that
The staff was very happy that we had a quenched on the table and although our blade was fat
We white we like fat blades. The grinder can can solve a lot of problems and we want and Marvel the only blade
Because it was so thick they didn't wooden warp at all or crack. No warps no cracks
Our blade was actually straight and it was hard
We would have had a little more bevel with more time, but I saw we are focused
Yeah, and just getting that out at the end today the second day of filming they they brought us all up and they said hey
The judges are now going to take a closer look at your work because they actually temper your knives overnight
Oh, yeah, that's what yeah
Yeah, so there so we a few takes and then we found Oh
We do some talks about what we feel about our experience and then we're told and it sucked
But we were ready to really fix that blade up, but we were okay with it actually
Well, here's what happened is when they when they mentioned that
Mark and Jessica's blade how to crack. Oh that was heartbreaking. Yeah when when
Jessica but when the judge took their knife and said he saw a crack in it
Everybody's hearts sank. Nobody knew about Madame. Yeah. Nobody knew not even they knew about it
I was gonna throw a fit if they if they actually kicked them off and passed us
I actually pulled one of the producers to the side and said hey, you can't do this. This is wrong
And the reason being is because you know, I mean were around masters
We all know my knife look obviously the worst and so we got to get rid of it
We could have had a little
England Mecca luckily to have it get kicked off over something as small and and mundane as it's not even a structural
crack at all
so it's what had happened was is I didn't feel that it was right for us to move forward in the
Competition and so that's why I felt like throwing it on this one. I did not agree with him, you know with marketing
Yeah, and and they were considering that and and so it was important for for everybody to know that
yes, the contestants also have a say in what goes on and
we you know, we're gonna be back for redemption anyways, so we're
We're definitely gonna chop buildings for come back for redemption. So yeah. Hope to see you guys again soon. Yeah, we'll be back
We're coming back. It's just
sacrifices must be made and
So a date it's a date sure we did have much left to do. So we were
able to go back to hotel and hang out and then
day three instead of having to worry about a large bunch of stuff we uh,
Went out the town New York. Yeah, we went and visited, New York
we went to the Metropolitan Museum and
We we ended up with some armor to talk about different armors in the mat and people asking us questions
cuz here both talking about I know it was made because as you can see
I'm an armored head heart and now I mobilize for the heart to I've gotten heavy deploys withing now
Yeah, we were - we were sent to her guides
We ended up when we went to New York - for to film for Forge and fire
We ended up being tour guides over at the Metropolitan Museum. I got a whole lot of fun. It was pretty good
So many you guys have any questions. Please let us know
We're actually a lot of talk about anything that happen on the show
So anything you will have questions if you everyone contact us to ask us about certain things you might have
issues with with a show or any questions about
Our experience on the show let us know and if you're also interested in any of our working or anything like that
Just check this out at Vanguard smithing comm
Check out our Instagram and like us on Facebook
Awesome. Okay that a good day
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